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Hungarian - January challenge thread | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Multilingual Lounge |  | |
| maxval Pentaglot Senior Member Bulgaria maxval.co.nr Joined 4863 days ago 852 posts - 1577 votes  Speaks: Hungarian*, Bulgarian, English, Spanish, Russian Studies: Latin, Modern Hebrew | Message 353 of 1549 28 March 2011 at 8:01pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
I would say "a legjobb" or something like that.
Kossuth Rádió is a state owned radio and it is kind of "official". Probably wou wont hear slang there, unless very rare cases. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| maxval Pentaglot Senior Member Bulgaria maxval.co.nr Joined 4863 days ago 852 posts - 1577 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, Bulgarian, English, Spanish, Russian Studies: Latin, Modern Hebrew | Message 354 of 1549 28 March 2011 at 8:20pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
I have at home 300+ television channels. I have even a Swiss German television. I have also Austrian and German television channels. I dont speak German, I know only a few German words, but even so I noticed that the language spoken on the Swiss German channel is TOTALLY DIFFERENT from the language spoken on Austrian and German channels. For me there is a difference as between Spanish and Italian. My questions are: * is an average Swiss-German person able to fully understand Standard German without having studied Standard German? * is an average Austrian or German able to fully understand Swiss-German? I mean an Austrian or a German not with any native dialect similar to Swiss-German - for example a German from North Germany whose native language is a Saxone German dialect and he knows only this dialect and Standard German, can such a person understand Swiss German? how much he will understand? * in Swiss-French and Swiss-Italian schools what language is being taught - Standard German or Swiss-German? * is Swiss-German used in writing, in literature or it is only a spoken version of German not used in writing? * How a Swiss-German feels about Germany? How a Swiss-French feels about France? How a Swiss-Italian feels about Italy? as foreign countries? or as something "friendly"? * in other words: how a Swiss-German considers himself, as an ethnically German person who lives in Switzerland or as an ethnically Swiss person whose native language is German? 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| maxval Pentaglot Senior Member Bulgaria maxval.co.nr Joined 4863 days ago 852 posts - 1577 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, Bulgarian, English, Spanish, Russian Studies: Latin, Modern Hebrew | Message 355 of 1549 28 March 2011 at 8:47pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
I have other questions too about the Swiss situation. Are there translators in the sessions of the Swiss Federal Parliament and Government? Or they agree on speaking in the same language? For example what happens when in the Federal Government there is a Swiss-German member who speak only German and French, and a Swiss-Italian member who speaks only Italian and French, so no one know the others native language? The members of the Government then choose a common language that every one of them knows, or every member speaks in his respective native language using translators? This is interesting for me. There are also other countries in the world with multiple languages, but there are different ways for managing the situation. For example in Finland there are 2 official languages, but there is obligatory for every person who wants to be a public office holder to know both languages. In Switzerland it is not obligatory to know all the 4 official languages, so I wonder what is the solution of the possible problems? For example what is the command language in the Swiss Army? 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Kisfroccs Bilingual Pentaglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 5199 days ago 388 posts - 549 votes Speaks: French*, German*, EnglishC1, Swiss-German, Hungarian Studies: Italian, Serbo-Croatian | Message 356 of 1549 28 March 2011 at 8:59pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Difficult to answer your questions without generalising... but I will try :)
My questions are: * is an average Swiss-German person able to fully understand Standard German without having studied Standard German? Ehm... everyone who goes to school is bound to learn High German (not dialect). However, I know a lot of people who are uncomfortable speaking High German (a majority) or refuse to speak it (especially elderly people). In an extra course in my school, where we are mixed, French-speaking and German-speaking, a guy came and he prefered to speak French than High German : he clearly stated that he did not liked German, so he wouldn't speak it. Only Swiss-german or French :p. * is an average Austrian or German able to fully understand Swiss-German? I mean an .Austrian or a German not with any native dialect similar to Swiss-German - for example a German from North Germany whose native language is a Saxone German dialect and he knows only this dialect and Standard German, can such a person understand Swiss German? how much he will understand? No. Clearly not. I'm a native speaker of High German, have lived all my life in the french-speaking part of Switzerland and hardly came in contact with Swiss-german. The few time I was in Bern as kid I understand nearly nothing. I couldn't even say "thanks" or the number... However, now I'm in a class that bilingual and a lot of my colleagues speak Swiss-german. It took me 3-4 month to understand what they were saying. I still cannot speak, it's been two years... * in Swiss-French and Swiss-Italian schools what language is being taught - Standard German or Swiss-German? Standard German. And that's a big problem. :) But Swiss-german cannot be taught, or it would be as there isn't any grammar or textbook, and every region as his own dialect. I live in Fribourg, it's 30km away from Bern : the dialect is really different. The easier one to understand are around Zurich. Fribourg is a hard one, but the helliest one ist in Wallis : you are under the impression they are speaking Arabic :). * is Swiss-German used in writing, in literature or it is only a spoken version of German not used in writing? It is only used in the spoken version, Sms, Mail etc. All what is informal. However, a lot of "swissgerman" expression slip in the newspaper. Written in Standard German. * How a Swiss-German feels about Germany? Usually, Germany is not seen as the friendly one. It can go so far as that someone insult you. That happened to me : I was in the train, phoning. A guy said me that if I was speaking German, I should go out and not bother him. I had a heated argument, because I felt very insulted : he did not order me out because I was speaking loudly, he ordered me out because I was speaking German and not Swiss-german. Clearly, my existence bothered him. (he said so). When I'm speaking German, people tend to be unfriendly. My reaction is then to switch to French.. and oh! their behaviour completely changes. But honestly I think this little fight between Swiss-german and German is ridiculous. It hurts only people (including me). And I don't know how to react to these things : I'm half German, half Swiss and often I'm between, even if my heart belongs to Switzerland (the French Part, I don't think I can fully understand the Swiss-german. They really have another culture). How a Swiss-French feels about France? Same here, only that it's not as strong as the animosity between Swiss-german and German. We speak French like in France, and most of the time it's teasing. However, in Geneva there is a stronger animosity toward French than of the rest of the French-part. How a Swiss-Italian feels about Italy? as foreign countries? Same as above. I don't know on which degree. * in other words: how a Swiss-German considers himself, as an ethnically German person who lives in Switzerland or as an ethnically Swiss person whose native language is German? As an ethnically Swiss person whose native language is Swiss-german. Does that answer your questions ? :) Kisfröccs 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Kisfroccs Bilingual Pentaglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 5199 days ago 388 posts - 549 votes Speaks: French*, German*, EnglishC1, Swiss-German, Hungarian Studies: Italian, Serbo-Croatian | Message 357 of 1549 28 March 2011 at 9:11pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Are there translators in the sessions of the Swiss Federal Parliament and Government? Or they agree on speaking in the same language? Yes, Italian, French, German are the official languages of Switzerland. Rumantsch is not used. So, there are translator, but everyone is free to defend his text in the language he speaks. However, Italian speaker speaks either French or German, because nobody speaks Italian apart them. Maybe one day this will change. We have already voted that every language should be equally repressented in the Parliament.
For example what happens when in the Federal Government there is a Swiss-German member who speak only German and French, and a Swiss-Italian member who speaks only Italian and French, so no one know the others native language? The members of the Government then choose a common language that every one of them knows, or every member speaks in his respective native language using translators? Every member speaks in his own language. Courses are offered to learn the other languages though. In Switzerland it is not obligatory to know all the 4 official languages, so I wonder what is the solution of the possible problems? I don't know... it works so far :). But French and German is widely spread. For example what is the command language in the Swiss Army? I don't know, I don't do the army (all men are obligated to do it). But I think it's in the language where they are staying. French in the French part, Swiss-german in the German part, Italian in the Italian and so on. I could not imagine an officer here, in my region, command in German :),but rather in French. Edited by Kisfroccs on 28 March 2011 at 9:12pm 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| maxval Pentaglot Senior Member Bulgaria maxval.co.nr Joined 4863 days ago 852 posts - 1577 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, Bulgarian, English, Spanish, Russian Studies: Latin, Modern Hebrew | Message 358 of 1549 28 March 2011 at 9:18pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
Yes. And this is very interesting! There is like a wall between Eastern and Western Europe in this sense, a wall bigger that the Iron Curtain. This Swiss situation is simply IMPOSSIBLE to happen in Eastern Europe. For example a Hungarian from Slovakia will NEVER identify himself as a Slovak with Hungarian language or even as a Slovak with Hungarian ethnicity. He will always say that he is a Hungarian living in Slovakia and he will emphasis on the fact he is NOT a Slovak in any sense, he is only a citizen of Slovakia, but nothing more. I think that the Western European version is much better, this is why there are almost no ethnic conflicts in Western Europe. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| maxval Pentaglot Senior Member Bulgaria maxval.co.nr Joined 4863 days ago 852 posts - 1577 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, Bulgarian, English, Spanish, Russian Studies: Latin, Modern Hebrew | Message 359 of 1549 28 March 2011 at 9:31pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
Interesting! Let me tell the example of the Austrian-Hungarian Empire! There were 10 official languages in the country (German, Hungarian, Czech, Slovak, Polish, Italian, Ruthenian, Romanian, Croatian, Serbian) and the governments working languages were 2: German and Hungarian. However in the Austrian-Hungarian Army there was only 1 command language: German! The official explanation was that if there was more than one command language, then this would possibly cause many misunderstandings in a situation of war. But in Switzerland there are no wars, so this is not a trouble for the Swiss Army... :-) 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Kisfroccs Bilingual Pentaglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 5199 days ago 388 posts - 549 votes Speaks: French*, German*, EnglishC1, Swiss-German, Hungarian Studies: Italian, Serbo-Croatian | Message 360 of 1549 28 March 2011 at 9:32pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
And don't understand : I will never identify myself with being French, it's simply impossible. Or a Swiss-german will never say that he is German. He is Swiss, and his native language is not German, but Swiss-german. In the CAE test I did, I could choose Swiss-german as a mothertongue (but my mothertongue is French, and German from my mother). French happens to be the language of Switzerland, France, Belgium and Luxemburg. But I will never identify myself as these. Even the French I speak is my identity : I do not speak the French they speak in France :). But you are right, in Switzerland the conflicts are futile in comparison what happens in the East. And a lot of people in the West are not aware of the fact that there are a lot ot ethnical conflicts in Hungary, Slovakia, Romania etc. Conflicts between minorities, roms, ethnical and political problems (Nagy-Magyarország for instance). The mentality are not the same I should add. Really not. The Iron Curtain may have fallen, but it's still two worlds I think. Don't you think ? By the way, I was in Sofia, and your photos reminded me of mine :). I came from Niš, Serbia, and from there to Sofia with the car. Rila was beautiful, really. But Bulgaria was a bit too cold for me after being in Serbia and Hungary were we had a warm welcome. (I was in Pécs and in Niš) And it was really a shock to see all these cars from western europe :). We still haven't understood how the "highway" in Bulgaria works. The Otoban :) (nice word !). Could you explain ? Kisfröccs 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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