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Complications with the opposite sex in LL | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5146 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes  Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 1 of 50 17 October 2011 at 9:57am | IP Logged |
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And before you ask - LL means language learning :-)
On the forum "Fluent in three months", there is as you know a "ladies only room". One of the topics which were raised was the apprehension particularly young women have when using a web cam or when getting close (as in good friends) to someone of the opposite sex due to language learning. When I asked why more people did not use pictures here on the forum, that was also one of the issues which were raised. I will not use any of the other posts in that thread, to not infringe on any copy right, but here is what I wrote: ----------------- I just take for granted that in practically every male-female relationship there is the possibility that at some point one will show more interest than the other, and often that one will be the male. I think girls more often want to be "just friends" whereas guys always keep their options open. That is not neccesarily a bad thing, hey, it is positive that people really like you, it just means that you must have your eyes open, and be aware of how you act. From when I was younger I recognize that feeling of betrayal, the "But-I thought-we were-just-friends-and-relaxed-with-you,-how-could-you-read-a nything-more-into-it". The thing is that everyone "reads" your actions all the time, and sometimes they misinterpret them. We girls do that all the time too. How many times have you not engaged in a conversation with one of your female friends overanalyzing everything a certain guy has said and done? Guys do that too, and particularly when you get really close as friends, and you let your guard down, it gets more complicated for them to read us. I have a friend who was always in that situation. She kept telling me" Oh, but we are just friends, he is not into me", when I could see with half an eye, that her being relaxed and being friendly, gave them the wrong idea. Being a smiling, chatty person who tend to give people my full attention has gotten me into trouble on numerous occasions too, particularly with shy men who do not often get attention from women. They do not see that I smile and chat with everyone, they just see that I smile and chat with THEM – something they are not used to. I have had cases where I have had veritable stalkers. And it is quite possible that in a language learning situation you get more close to a person than you do ordinarily, which intensifies the problem. At one point when I was still in my twenties I was taking private lessons with a Dutch monk, and during our conversations I had told him about my predicament that men often read more into my smiles than they should. Me obviously thinking, that if there was one man on the planet I did not need to worry about, it would be a monk. Nevertheless he became so intense, that at one point he started calling me every day calling me "my little sunshine" (a pun on my Norwegian name) and waiting for me at the corner every day when I went to work. I had to have him banned from my work place, and have my colleagues answer all my calls to shield me. This problem does get a bit better when you get older, but what I learned was to be allert all the time to any misinterpretations of my actions, and then modify my behaviour immediately. It doesn't have to be anything drastic, just smile a bit less, talk more to other people, avoid being alone with that person, just minor changes that let you both save your face. If you are from two very different cultures, things obviously become even more complicated, and you have to be even more aware, because situations can become quite dangerous due to misinterpretations. So my advice: Be friendly, but be allert and prepared to change your behaviour. Misunderstandings can be as confusing and unpleasent for them as they are to us. ----------------- So the question on this forum is: Has this been an issue for anyone else, and if so, what is your attitude? Oh. And since this is not a ladies' room, everyone is of course as always most welcome to comment, regardless of gender :-) Edited by Solfrid Cristin on 17 October 2011 at 10:00am 7 persons have voted this message useful | |
| jasoninchina Senior Member China Joined 5043 days ago 221 posts - 306 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Mandarin, Italian | Message 2 of 50 17 October 2011 at 11:43am | IP Logged |
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I can definitely relate to what you're saying. I've been on both sides of it a few times. Since moving to China, there have been a number of woman who have become overly interested in the "foreigner." Fortunate for me, they tend to back off when they find out I'm married. The Chinese are very respectful of this. In the States, I don't usually lead with that fact when I first meet someone. In China, I have learned how to stick it into the conversation early on. So the best advice I can give to any married folks is to bring up your spouse early on. Then mention him/her every now and again, but not so often that the person becomes nauseated.
I'd love to read what some of our single members have to say on the issue. When I was young, I was on both sides of this a number of times. The worst thing you can do is nothing. In high school, a girl dragged me along for four years. I can't be too upset though, I did it to another girl for two. If you know that someone has feelings for you, don't leave them hanging. Better yet, nip it in the bud. A decisive action when you first notice it can go a long way. 5 persons have voted this message useful | |
| schoenewaelder Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5372 days ago 759 posts - 1197 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: German, Spanish, Dutch | Message 3 of 50 17 October 2011 at 2:58pm | IP Logged |
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Intereting topic, it's probably going to be tough restricting it to just the language learning aspect. One thing I've noticed on Lang-8, is that male writers tend to be corrected by females, and vice versa.
I usually find it much easier to chat to females initially, but I find it does start to get awkward after a while, I've had several initially great (friendly language learning) experiences with female tandem partners, but they always seem to fizzle out after about 6 months, much to my disappointment. Same-sex friends are more boring but less complicated. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| montmorency Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4640 days ago 2371 posts - 3676 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Danish, Welsh | Message 4 of 50 17 October 2011 at 5:18pm | IP Logged |
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There are always complications with the opposite sex.
7 persons have voted this message useful | |
| PinkCordelia Diglot Newbie Wales Joined 4623 days ago 31 posts - 77 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: Italian, Welsh | Message 5 of 50 17 October 2011 at 8:45pm | IP Logged |
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I think it's a particular problem with LL for two reasons. The innocent reason may simply
be that we don't know appropriate social codes and therefore give out the wrong signals. The more cynical reason might be that as a "foreigner" you are expected to have lower/different standards of sexual behaviour and also as a foreigner you can be treated in a way that would be demeaning to local women. I hope that doesn't sound too bitter and twisted - it's not meant to be but does reflect my experience of time being "foreign". Maybe, less cynical this time, being foreign just makes you more exotic and attractive ... 3 persons have voted this message useful | |
| fortheo Senior Member United States Joined 4848 days ago 187 posts - 222 votes Studies: French | Message 6 of 50 17 October 2011 at 9:27pm | IP Logged |
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Hmmm, I must agree that as a male it is easier for me to talk to a female at first. For some reason they just seem less judgmental. The problem with me has been ( as the OP has somewhat said ) I am somewhat shy and am not use to woman giving me attention. That and some woman are naturally flirty, and vice versa. Put two people like this together and someone is bound to have stronger feelings than the other.
I have had an experience like this happen, and though it was a complete mess and i lost a friend. It did help teach me a lot about myself as a person. I guess bottom line is, if you want a language partner...look only for a language partner and nothing more. However, of course things happen so just be careful not to hurt your self or the other person in the process. Edited by fortheo on 17 October 2011 at 9:31pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| July Diglot Senior Member Spain Joined 5085 days ago 113 posts - 208 votes Speaks: English*, SpanishB2 Studies: French | Message 7 of 50 17 October 2011 at 9:36pm | IP Logged |
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Language exchanges are where I have problems. A lot of people seem to use them to meet
people they might 'want to get to know better' - which sounds great. But I always seem to end up with a guy who is either wildly egotistical or wants to impress me to the extent that they refuse to allow me to practice but simply continue talking at me in English and ignoring my attempts at changing the language until I make my excuses and try to leave or end up being rude to them. At which point, having completely ruined their chances, they ask me out. To which the answer is 'No' in both languages. And I'm just left bewildered by the whole thing. I've given up going to intercambios because it just kept happening. My Spanish friends thought it was hilarious. Edited by July on 17 October 2011 at 9:40pm 3 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5193 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 8 of 50 17 October 2011 at 10:07pm | IP Logged |
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I'd like to say first of all that I've had quite a few female language partners and students, and I'd like to think that I was a good, respectful teacher/partner for all of them. Had those women not taken the chance to meet a male stranger, we'd have never met and we couldn't have helped eachother.
Yet, I understand the predicament most women are in, as most men would be more than happy to have a language relationship develop into more. At the same time, I've found that this underlying tension sometimes makes the language partnership more interesting and motivating... and this applies to every other aspect of life, anyway, not just LL. At the same time, let's not hide our heads in the sand -- it's easy for a woman to say that she isn't interested in a romantic relationship AFTER she's realized that she isn't attracted to the guy. A single woman could well be interested in a romantic relationship if she happens to be attracted to the guy, so it's kind of easy to pin this on guys. Maybe we're just less choosy. But if a woman has the desire to seek a language partner and has no desire for a romantic relationship, why not come forth and say it right off the bat? If the guy is really interested in a language relationship, he won't mind -- and if he was looking for more, you'll know right away. This should avoid some of the potential misunderstandings. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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