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German: massive input in Berlin

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geoffw
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 Message 41 of 295
10 January 2014 at 4:26pm | IP Logged 
BTW, Kneipe is a word I didn't learn in Germany at all, and only learned later from
reading books. Surely the word is known in the south (I bet they have them in Munich),
but auf dem Land everyone would go to the local Gasthaus (and you certainly could expect
to hear the local language spoken there).
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patrickwilken
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 Message 42 of 295
10 January 2014 at 4:28pm | IP Logged 
geoffw wrote:
BTW, Kneipe is a word I didn't learn in Germany at all, and only learned later from
reading books. Surely the word is known in the south (I bet they have them in Munich),
but auf dem Land everyone would go to the local Gasthaus (and you certainly could expect
to hear the local language spoken there).


That's funny Kneipe is one of the first words I learned! But perhaps that's a Northern word. The word, Gasthaus, obviously makes sense, but I have never heard it used here (but beware I am only have B2 German). To me a "Gasthaus" sounds like a much bigger place with beer garden.

Here we have either: Kneipe (small, smoking bar - dive in American); Bars - fancy filled with foreigners and Germans; and Beergarten.

Such is the gentrification of Berlin that I heard last year that there were expat hipster Kneipe tours going on, which I both approve of (see the locals!) and don't (the locals aren't animals in a zoo).

Kneipes are slowly dying out around here in Neukölln, as the area gets gentrified and they are replaced by more standard bars. The level of smoking in Kneipes makes it hard for me to enjoy them, but if you wanted a fast way to learn idiomatic German they would be good resource.



Edited by patrickwilken on 10 January 2014 at 4:37pm

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geoffw
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 Message 43 of 295
10 January 2014 at 4:39pm | IP Logged 
For all I know there were plenty of local places known as "Kneipe," and I just never
heard about it. But between the Gasthauses (as the Americans would say) and the never-
ending series of local Fests complete with beer tent, one could perhaps be forgiven for
not noticing. In Munich, the only places I remember having beer were Oktoberfest, the
Hofbrau Haus and restaurants.

EDIT: A "Gasthaus" might best be translated as an Inn or a Publick House.
Traditionally, it was a place for travelers to spend the night, as well as a social
meeting place for the locals, with a common room for dining and drinking. There is also
generally a Stammtisch reserved for the regulars who will eat, drink, talk politics and
play cards. I used to go to play chess. I seem to recall seeing TV programs where local
politicians will appear, similar to weekend roundtable discussion programs like NBC's
Meet the Press, and they will talk politics on camera in a Gasthaus with a big glass of
beer next to them. I don't remember if they drink on camera, but probably.

Edited by geoffw on 10 January 2014 at 4:45pm

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patrickwilken
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 Message 44 of 295
10 January 2014 at 4:42pm | IP Logged 
geoffw wrote:
For all I know there were plenty of local places known as "Kneipe," and I just never
heard about it. But between the Gasthauses (as the Americans would say) and the never-
ending series of local Fests complete with beer tent, one could perhaps be forgiven for
not noticing. In Munich, the only places I remember having beer were Oktoberfest, the
Hofbrau Haus and restaurants.


What would be a somewhat down-and-out bar, full will older locals (some alcoholics) be called in the South? They are so common in Berlin it's inconceivable that you could get past A1 German without learning it.

EDIT: Actually it is a Northern word:



I have never heard of Wirtschaft/Wirtshaus.

Edited by patrickwilken on 10 January 2014 at 4:47pm

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geoffw
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 Message 45 of 295
10 January 2014 at 4:47pm | IP Logged 
I was trying to think of that myself. They weren't as common as Berlin (in the
countryside, at least), but they existed. I think I heard some places called "Bar" and
"Wirtshaus." (Also note my edit above if you haven't already.)
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patrickwilken
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Studies: German

 
 Message 46 of 295
10 January 2014 at 4:50pm | IP Logged 
geoffw wrote:
I was trying to think of that myself. They weren't as common as Berlin (in the
countryside, at least), but they existed. I think I heard some places called "Bar" and
"Wirtshaus." (Also note my edit above if you haven't already.)


So Kneipes serve food, but I think they are more down-and-out then Gasthauses (it's a bit odd using English grammar with German words, but it seems better when writing English - perhaps).

Berlin is a very poor city by and large, so it's not surprising to see them. They strike me as old fashioned in a way. People are quite polite. You acknowledge the other people in the bar as you enter and leave, for instance.

Having a beer and playing chess sounds like a very civilized way to learn German.

Edited by patrickwilken on 10 January 2014 at 4:52pm

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geoffw
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Speaks: English*, German, Yiddish
Studies: Modern Hebrew, French, Dutch, Italian, Russian

 
 Message 47 of 295
10 January 2014 at 4:55pm | IP Logged 
patrickwilken wrote:

That's funny Kneipe is one of the first words I learned! But perhaps that's a Northern
word.


Quite possibly the very first thing I, and many other Americans learned to say was
"Gruess Gott." Apparently this was regional, as well. At the local Gasthaus, the standard
greeting was "servus" (incidentally, also used in Hungarian, as I later discovered,
probably originally from Latin), and sometimes "Gruezi" (which I remember as sounding
more like "Gruess-di"). When answering the phone (and only then, IIRC), one would use
"Hallo."
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geoffw
Triglot
Senior Member
United States
Joined 2986 days ago

1134 posts - 1865 votes 
Speaks: English*, German, Yiddish
Studies: Modern Hebrew, French, Dutch, Italian, Russian

 
 Message 48 of 295
10 January 2014 at 4:59pm | IP Logged 
patrickwilken wrote:

People are quite polite. You acknowledge the other people in the bar as you enter and
leave, for instance.


I always figured that was a rural thing. You would nod to and possibly shake hands with
most everyone, as well as the proprietor/proprietress, and say "servus." I guess it's
just a German thing!


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